{"id":465,"date":"2011-09-15T14:54:09","date_gmt":"2011-09-15T21:54:09","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/?p=465"},"modified":"2011-09-26T08:18:42","modified_gmt":"2011-09-26T15:18:42","slug":"of-course-the-earth-isnt-flat-of-course-smoking-is-bad-for-you-why-does-this-have-to-do-with-the-stock-market","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/?p=465","title":{"rendered":"Of course the Earth isn&#8217;t flat.  Of course smoking is bad for you.  What does this have to do with the stock market?"},"content":{"rendered":"\t<p>We will all look back in 100 years and wonder why people ever invested in the stock market. \u00a0It will seem like such an obviously misguided and\u00a0colossally\u00a0bad idea; how did we ever think that could work out?<\/p>\n\t<p>I admit that I do not understand the stock market. \u00a0It isn&#8217;t that I don&#8217;t understand how to pick stocks (I don&#8217;t but that is beside the point); it is that I don&#8217;t understand the CONCEPT of the stock market: Why pay money for stocks? \u00a0Why use a second hand swap meet of useless company baseball cards as a vehicle to save for retirement? \u00a0It is silly.<\/p>\n\t<p style=\"padding-left: 30px;\">Point 1: \u00a0<strong>As in poker, you need to know which table to play at<\/strong>. \u00a0Put another way,<strong> inside information is the only way to consistently beat the market<\/strong>.<\/p>\n\t<p style=\"padding-left: 30px;\">Regular folks investing in stocks is like you trying to win at the World Series of Poker. \u00a0We are like a toy boat on the ocean; \u00a0it would just be luck if we ended up where we wanted.<\/p>\n\t<p style=\"padding-left: 60px;\">Along this same line, I disagree with making it illegal to trade on inside information.<\/p>\n\t<p style=\"padding-left: 60px;\">Publicly the industry needs to say it is illegal to trade on inside information. \u00a0Why? \u00a0Because no idiot (meaning us) would invest in the stock market if they knew the game was rigged to benefit those with special information. \u00a0That is the democratic draw of the stock market; average people can participate and win&#8230;after all, the information is all out there, right? \u00a0WRONG.<\/p>\n\t<p style=\"padding-left: 60px;\"><strong>Funds or people that beat the market consistently and trade frequently are likely cheating with inside information&#8230;period<\/strong>. \u00a0Mathematically it wouldn&#8217;t be hard to target any group\/fund\/person with consistent market beating returns that are outside a normal range&#8230;.and assume they are cheating. \u00a0Start investigating them.<\/p>\n\t<p style=\"padding-left: 60px;\"><strong>The reason I am for making insider trading legal instead of investigating everyone is that if you made it legal, people would hopefully stop thinking of the stock market as a vehicle for savings and start thinking about it for what it is: \u00a0A\u00a0cutthroat\u00a0gambling casino for the ultra-rich where the buy in is OUR money. <\/strong><\/p>\n\t<p style=\"padding-left: 60px;\">I don&#8217;t have a problem with the ultra-rich betting against themselves all day with their own money; if they wreck that stock market it only wrecks them. \u00a0The problem is that we give them OUR money and then they wreck that stock market and get bailed out. \u00a0In that scenario, they win if they win, and they win if we lose. \u00a0Seems like a pretty good deal for the finance folks, huh?<\/p>\n\t<p style=\"padding-left: 30px;\">Point 2: <strong> How can stocks go up faster than inflation + growth?<\/strong><\/p>\n\t<p style=\"padding-left: 30px;\">No asset class can consistently outpace inflation + real growth over time. \u00a0People say Social Security doesn&#8217;t appreciate like stocks do; your rate of return would be better with stocks. \u00a0WRONG. \u00a0It might be better over time..<strong>.but just wait until the first generation of people try to retire who have seen negative stock returns over their period of savings. \u00a0That will be the end of stocks as a retirement savings vehicle,<\/strong> and those people will eat potatoes and live by the wood fireplace in the winter.<\/p>\n\t<p style=\"padding-left: 30px;\">It will also make us, as a nation, forever chained to the fortunes of the stock market (a very bad idea). \u00a0The government will always have to intervene if the stock market tanks because so much is tied up in it. This is a moral hazard for traders, since they know they will always be bailed out. \u00a0Additionally, their speculation is at the expense of our retirement.<\/p>\n\t<p style=\"padding-left: 30px;\">This scenario of negative stock returns for retirees over the period of their career simply hasn&#8217;t happened yet. 100 years ago there was no retirement. \u00a0It is a modern concept. \u00a0Then there were pension plans (and Social Security), which were ponzi-like schemes where you always needed a larger portion of workers paying in than old people taking out to maintain them. \u00a0401K plans didn&#8217;t exist until the 1978, so basically no generation has yet retired depending on stocks. \u00a0Using stocks as a vehicle for normal people to save is a new and unproven concept.<\/p>\n\t<p style=\"padding-left: 30px;\">If stocks cannot consistently outpace inflation + growth, then putting your money in the stock market is little more than gambling&#8230;and gambling against people who know a lot more about it than you.<\/p>\n\t<p style=\"padding-left: 30px;\">Point 3: <strong><a href=\"http:\/\/www.laphamsquarterly.org\/essays\/trust-issues.php?page=all\" target=\"_blank\"> The miracle of compound interest only works if everyone doesn&#8217;t employ it<\/a>.<\/strong> If stocks worked their magic for us and multiplied our money through investing, and then everyone was able to do that, would we all be rich? NO. Compounding interest can create money on paper no doubt; but it will only ever be able to buy what is available in the real world. \u00a0It would simply create inflation.<strong> I repeat: \u00a0No asset class can consistently compound faster than inflation + growth for everyone.<\/strong><\/p>\n\t<p style=\"padding-left: 30px;\">Point 4: <strong> Stocks don&#8217;t produce anything. \u00a0We can&#8217;t all be <a href=\"http:\/\/en.wikipedia.org\/wiki\/Rent-seeking\" target=\"_blank\">rent seekers<\/a>.<\/strong><\/p>\n\t<p style=\"padding-left: 30px;\">If we were all, every single one of us, able to use stocks as a retirement vehicle to compound our money while doing nothing, then what would we be able to buy? \u00a0Other people&#8217;s stocks perhaps, but there would be nothing else to spend our money on. \u00a0In short, wealth is produced by improving stuff, by working&#8230;not by shuffling paper in a second hand market. \u00a0<strong>You can&#8217;t eat a stock certificate.<\/strong><\/p>\n\t<p style=\"padding-left: 30px;\">Point 5: \u00a0<strong>Traders and computers (HFT) will ruin the stock market<\/strong>.<\/p>\n\t<p style=\"padding-left: 30px;\">The primary players (traders and computers) are not looking to invest; they are looking for arbitrage. \u00a0They don&#8217;t care about investments, or the health of the underlying economy; they are simply looking for the next trade, whether it is in pork bellies or Swiss Francs. \u00a0The larger the market gets, the more tempting it is to try to rent seek from it. \u00a0They are extracting profits from doing nothing.<\/p>\n\t<p style=\"padding-left: 30px;\"><strong>~70% of trades are computers trading against other computers. \u00a0Why would we agree to participate in this<\/strong>? \u00a0<strong>The stock market has devolved into a computer game<\/strong>, and we are\u00a0the\u00a0losers.<\/p>\n\t<p>As we look back in 100 years (probably less), we will realize that it was a rigged game, whose main benefit was to extract money from the dupes (us) and funnel it to the rule makers (traders). \u00a0We supplied the fuel; they extracted the profits. \u00a0In the end very little was ever financed; very little was returned, and all the financiers got rich.<\/p>\n\t<p><strong>I took a religion class in college and always thought it was odd that nearly all major religions single out usury\/banking as evil. \u00a0Why single out one profession above others? \u00a0What is so insidious about banking that it gets a special mention above other professions? \u00a0Well, it is because they have a tendency to end up with all the money, when they don&#8217;t really do anything; it is simply fancy theft.<\/strong><\/p>\n\t<p>The stock market is the crowning\u00a0achievement\u00a0of fancy theft. \u00a0We will look back in 100 years and wonder how we could&#8217;ve ever thought buying stocks was a good idea&#8230;just like no one could&#8217;ve thought smoking was good idea, right?\n<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>We will all look back in 100 years and wonder why people ever invested in the stock market. \u00a0It will seem like such an obviously misguided and\u00a0colossally\u00a0bad idea; how did we ever think that could work out? I admit that I do not understand the stock market. \u00a0It isn&#8217;t that I don&#8217;t understand how to [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"jetpack_post_was_ever_published":false,"_jetpack_newsletter_access":"","_jetpack_newsletter_tier_id":0},"categories":[9],"tags":[28],"jetpack_sharing_enabled":true,"jetpack_featured_media_url":"","jetpack_shortlink":"https:\/\/wp.me\/p3IMYj-7v","jetpack-related-posts":[{"id":320,"url":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/?p=320","url_meta":{"origin":465,"position":0},"title":"The stock market is a meaningless ponzi scheme.","author":"kellio","date":"June 16, 2010","format":false,"excerpt":"There.\u00a0 I said it. And I mean it.\u00a0 Not that certain stocks are a ponzi scheme....the entire concept of the stock market is a ponzi scheme. Think of all the people that work in industries related to the stock market......are you thinking?\u00a0 There are newspapers, magazines, and entire TV channels\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Favorite Entries&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Favorite Entries","link":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/?cat=10"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":31,"url":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/?p=31","url_meta":{"origin":465,"position":1},"title":"Home ownership: Does it make sense?","author":"kellio","date":"November 27, 2007","format":false,"excerpt":"Or more to the point: does it make sense for me? In a word, No. I'll explain why: A 150 to 200k dollar mortgage ends up between $1000 and $1200 bucks a month. Then you add on internet, gas, power, maintenance, cable, insurance, etc, etc, etc. The price is getting\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Inside My Head&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Inside My Head","link":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/?cat=9"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":769,"url":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/?p=769","url_meta":{"origin":465,"position":2},"title":"Income Inequality:  Labor is losing and we should care (since we are Labor)","author":"kellio","date":"January 13, 2015","format":false,"excerpt":"Many believe some version of the following regarding income inequality: The current income distribution is the free market outcome; we can't regulate ourselves out of income inequality...it is a natural outcome of our global economy. The statement is untrue.\u00a0 It is better worded as follows, \"The current income distribution is\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Inside My Head&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Inside My Head","link":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/?cat=9"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":597,"url":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/?p=597","url_meta":{"origin":465,"position":3},"title":"I think pensions are a good idea","author":"kellio","date":"May 23, 2013","format":false,"excerpt":"Retirement is a modern concept; people historically worked until they couldn't work anymore, at least in some capacity. Regardless, like most people, I would like to retire. \u00a0The question is: \u00a0How do you get the money? A Pension is a defined benefit; it pays a fixed amount per year until\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Inside My Head&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Inside My Head","link":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/?cat=9"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":612,"url":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/?p=612","url_meta":{"origin":465,"position":4},"title":"I still think pensions are a good idea (Part II)","author":"kellio","date":"May 30, 2013","format":false,"excerpt":"A friend of mine, whose opinion I respect, commented on my last post about why I like pensions: \"I think your post opens you up to some pretty serious critique, though. I mean, essentially what you are saying is, \"Why should I have to be responsible for my own future\u2026","rel":"","context":"In \"economics\"","block_context":{"text":"economics","link":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/?tag=economics"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":552,"url":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/?p=552","url_meta":{"origin":465,"position":5},"title":"Tax cuts for the rich do not stimulate the economy.  They aren&#8217;t even a neutral.  Tax cuts for the rich are a drain on the economy.","author":"kellio","date":"May 15, 2012","format":false,"excerpt":"A little high level data\/history here, and then we'll jump into Myths related to taxes for the rich. \u00a0I will provide a logical plausible mechanism for why low taxes for the rich do not stimulate the economy. 1. \u00a0The GDP growth rates during times of high marginal tax rates on\u2026","rel":"","context":"In \"economics\"","block_context":{"text":"economics","link":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/?tag=economics"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]}],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/465"}],"collection":[{"href":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcomments&post=465"}],"version-history":[{"count":14,"href":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/465\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":468,"href":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/465\/revisions\/468"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fmedia&parent=465"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcategories&post=465"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"http:\/\/chasingeden.com\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Ftags&post=465"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}